Are The L.A. Kings Done Dealing? A 24 Hour Exclusive.

Someone said, tweeted or wrote somewhere that Jack Johnson was on the ice for all four of the Penguins goals against the Columbus Blue Jackets. I haven’t verified this claim as true or not but, if it is, it makes me sad although, for the moment, sadness be damned.

Our top six is Kopitar, Brown, Williams, Richards, Carter & ____. ____ has been, at best, inconsistent this season. Unless Dean Lombardi intends a blockbuster surprise between now and the deadline hour, ____ will likely remain as our number six wing.

With goaltending and defense not the problem, that leaves the bottom seven. It’s seven because ___ is really not…you know if you can’t figure that out, you should be a Ducks fan.

Who could go? Stoll? Richardson? Lewis? Fraser will stay. Westgarth isn’t worth much. Clifford is too young and has far too much potential to be traded. Dustin Penner. But to who? And for what? A pick? Probably, but doesn’t that leave a hole in the scapegoat category? We need one of those during the season and playoffs. So Dustin Penner for a pick. “Hello, Burkie? Lombardi here. I know you need help on defense and goaltending but will you settle for a big, dumb, left wing who occasionally plays great but is often useless?”

I struggle with Dustin Penner’s value and, strangely, he may be worth more with the team than his return would be. I keep asking, “what if he gets hot?”

For those who claim Dean Lombardi will trade more defense to get offense, I respond, “doubt it.” Do not forget how much Lombardi values defensive depth. Jack Johnson may be his last outgoing defensive transaction unless a big return is coming the other way and I just don’t see it.

Sure would be nice if we had someone like Bud Holloway up right now to take that fourth line left wing spot or give options on the second and third line.

So, what do you think? What does Lombardi do?

On a tangent, these are the lines I would like to see next game:

Brown-Richards-Carter

Richardson-Kopitar-Williams

Penner-Stoll-Lewis

Clifford-Fraser-Nolan



Categories: L.A. Kings News

Tags: , , , , ,

53 replies

  1. richarson and lewis? ouch. i love these guys but always crack up when they get a scoring chanve and no mtter what its not gonna go in the net.

  2. I twooped Dillman and DB that JJ was on the ice for all 4 goals, not sure if that’s what you saw. To be fair, he was paired up with Wisniewski and I didn’t see any glaring mistakes on the goals against.

    Fraser is completely expendable, imo. Not worth much in a trade but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him gone next year because we have a team full of centers. It really would be nice if we had Holloway or Moller to choose from on the top six.

    I think Stoll still has some value around the league and is easily replaced in our lineup by Lokti/others. Would like to see him go so we can clear a spot for next year and still get something in return (like a pick).

    • You think Stoll fetches a 1st and 3rd round picks back? Only a 1st? If so, would Lombardi do it?

      • I have no fucking clue what he would return. I’m not good at this. I think a first round pick is more than good enough for an UFA though, even though he wants to stay here.

    • And don’t forget we have Bernier who wants to be a starter. And now that I say that DB tweets that Philly is seriously looking at goalies right now. It’s too bad we didn’t play him enough, we could have received fair value for him in a trade. The way we’ve played him this year he’s too much of an unknown, no one’s going to give us something very good in return.

      • Don’t be so sure of that. Bernier is still held in high regards around the league.

        I don’t see him leaving anyways unless we get a backup in return, which to me would mean it wouldn’t be a goalie for goalie swap, it’d be a bigger deal.

        • As a promising young goaltender…

          …Who hasn’t played enough games for them to tell whether he is the real deal or not. Sorry, sample size too small, should have been played more games this year.

  3. Brown-Kopitar-Williams
    Penner-Richards-Carter
    Clifford-Stoll-Lewis
    Richardson-Fraser-Nolan

  4. Philly and goalies………….
    Mike Richards welcomes Jeff Carter to LA
    “Dude, we have this guy named Quick who actually stops pucks, you’ve never seen anything like it!”

  5. Stoll seems best suited for that 3rd center spot and given he’s strong on faceoffs, that’s an asset thats needed down the stretch and in the playoffs, esp in PK situations. And prior to the Carter trade, I’d have held onto him for those faceoffs and those tight spots. But Carter was the best faceoff guy on the Flyers, and if killing PK with Richards can take that draw. With Carter we do have 3 top centers if during a game they had to be split up. So Stoll is expendable.

    Penner- I agree, as much as I don’t like him, you wont’ get back what he’s worth. Of course at some point, he’s gonna have to go, so maybe you cut your losses and deal him. Didn’t someone post that Toronto was interested?

    With Johnson gone, I guess Martinez is not as available. Nolan and King make Richardson expendable.
    I don’t see him making a big move, or moving Bernier until the summer after he signs Quick.
    Most GM’s will be trying to upgrade and he ‘s no different. I don’t think he’s done yet.

  6. Brown looked great from the left side when he’s played there. Where was that first goal from? The left side. They should use him and that shot more from that side.

    I have faint hopes and belief that Penner might find great chemistry with Richards and Carter. There is a great mixture of size, skill in both wings n skill and grit with Richards. I would love to see them try and see if it would work.

    The bottom six is tough. The centers are solid and responsible. Lokti will replace Stoll next year. Would love to see Stoll take a pay cut n be the 4th line center. I like Fraser and his nastiness, but I like Lokti at 3 and Stoll at 4 better. The wingers could be interchanged but I like the mixture of size and speed. I wish Lewis had some hands but he does have speed and is defensively responsible with value on the PK. Could be Richardson on the 3rd line instead of Cliffy n you have a pretty fast line, but can they score? The 4th line would then be a bruiser. That’s a lot of size and toughness. If we got ahead in games, I wouldn’t want to face that combo having to come from behind.

    And what about Gagne? Is he just done for the year or what? Are the Kings shelving him and quietly rehabbing him hoping to make the playoffs and use him then? That could be something. Put Gagne on Kopi’s left and move Brown to the 3rd line for the playoffs with Cliffy and Stoll. Yow that’s a bruiser. Just some ideas to toss around.

  7. brown-kopitar-williams
    carter-richards-nolan
    penner-stoll-lewis
    clifford-fraser-richardson

  8. I struggle with Dustin Penner’s value and, strangely, he may be worth more with the team than his return would be.

    … Since Penner’s return would likely be a seventh round pick, then yeah his value to the team is higher than his return would be. I don’t see where it’s so difficult to stop dicking around, just put the man in the lineup and leave him there and let him play hockey, but these ARE the Kings we’re talking about so this might be a difficult process.

    Who could go? Stoll? Richardson? Lewis? Fraser will stay. Westgarth isn’t worth much. Clifford is too young and has far too much potential to be traded.

    … Fraser should be on waivers already. He isn’t worth anything on the market. Neither is Westgarth, Richardson, or Lewis. You’re not going to get any more than a bag of beans for any of them.

    There’s no reason to deal Stoll. The Kings don’t have a replacement for him and they’re not going to find that replacement via trade. It would just be a trade for the sake of making a trade.

    Sure would be nice if we had someone like Bud Holloway up right now to take that fourth line left wing spot or give options on the second and third line.

    … LOL. Bud Holloway was never going to play for the L.A. Kings. Even if he was still in the organization, he’d be either a throw-in on a future trade or rotting in Manchester.

    Brown-Richards-Carter

    Richardson-Kopitar-Williams

    Penner-Stoll-Lewis

    Clifford-Fraser-Nolan

    … I don’t get why you’d move Brown off of Kopitar’s line. Keep him there. Keep Nolan on Richards’ line with Carter unless or until Gagne is able to come back and play. I see good potential with Nolan; just give him a chance to get a little more accustomed to NHL pace.

    Dump Fraser and play Loktionov between Clifford and Richardson, with the message to Loktionov to just put in good shifts and not worry about scoring; if Andrei improves his corner/board play, bump him up to the top six.

    • King and Nolan are playing, so I think Holloway would have been called up before both of them this year if he had stayed.

      • … I don’t believe Holloway or Moller were ever part of the Kings’ future plans, and that both of them made the 100% correct decision to go to Europe. It was either Europe or rot in the minors.

        King and Nolan were called up because of their size. That’s it. There were better candidates to call up, but none of them were as big physically as King and Nolan are.

        • What I’m saying is that he would have played his way onto the roster.

          This has nothing to do with whether their decision was right.

          Right now he leads Skelleftea in points and goals, and is 5th in the SEL in pts and 7th in goals. I think it’s very likely he is quite a bit better at hockey than those two I mentioned.

          Besides Lokti, Manchester is pretty even up front. No one is tearing it up (relatively) like he did or Holloway did last year. Vey is starting to come on strong lately, however, wouldn’t be surprised if we see him up (depending on whether Manch makes playoffs).

          • What I’m saying is that he would have played his way onto the roster.

            This has nothing to do with whether their decision was right.

            Right now he leads Skelleftea in points and goals, and is 5th in the SEL in pts and 7th in goals

            … He led Manchester in scoring for two years running, and couldn’t get a spot on a Kings’ team that was crying for offense.

            They just didn’t like Holloway, man. Organizations have their favored players, or at least they have their favored type of player. Holloway wasn’t favored here. There’s no way he would have been called up this season.

            I don’t even know why Dean would draft a guy he didn’t want, but then he didn’t like Dustin Penner and he traded for him, so who really knows what Lombardi is thinking – if he’s even thinking.

          • Three years ago Holloway played at frozen fury. I ran into Jim Fox after the game at a bat and told him I thought Holloway was really good, had a strong game and would look good on the 4th line. I asked him if he thought he could make the team and Fox said “not a chance.” he also basically said he didn’t think Holloway would be an NHL player.

            You know, it’s not favoritism in the most negative sense. It’s that different people value and look for different things. Since Dean has taken over, the value system has been on “complete” players. They just dot value strictly offensive guys. I’m hoping that the Carter trade signals a diversion from that course because it is exactly why we traded Cammy and gave up on Moulson, Boyle, Purcell and its why Holloway never got called up. (although I will always argue that I believe Bud was going to be given a very string chance at taking a spot this year, but we’ll just never know).

            It’s not right. I don’t like it. But it’s not so childish as just playing favorites. It’s much deeper than that. It’s the manifestation of a strongly-rooted philosophical view of the game of hockey. It’s not even a bad one, it’s just that, like everything else in life, when it isn’t counterbalanced it becomes a problem. Too much yin with no yang.

          • Just because you score lots of points doesn’t mean you aren’t a complete player.

            And BTW that was 3 years ago, so I’m sure he has rounded out his game since then.

            Also, JT, DL sent a scout not too long ago to check out Holloway and Moller. Holloway is on a one year contract over there so it seems pretty likely that he is at least gaining their attention.

          • Just because you score lots of points doesn’t mean you aren’t a complete player.

            I didn’t say it does.

            As for 3 years ago, I’m just relaying an anecdote.

          • Sorry JT. I’m going on a ‘DL fast’ today so I can’t answer why he would have drafted Holloway, or Moller for that matter.
            So I’ll leave you on your own.

            Always nice to read your posts though.

        • Who are the better candidates to call up? Cliche is the only one. Kozun is a scorer who isn’t really scoring and by all accounts Vey needs more seasoning. Also, Manchester is a large team in general. Besides King and Nolan were among the top scoters in Manchester so it wasn’t ONLY because of their size. Though that was a factor, they were both having good seasons.

          • Cliche is a center. I think he’ll probably run out his contract and try out somewhere else and probably toil in the minors for awhile longer and maybe play a few games in the NHL one day. That’s just wild speculation though.

            That was kinda my point about Manchester, slim pickings so they went with comparable production and someone who had size. There’s no doubt Holloway would be the clear leading scorer on the team, and he would have been called up at least over Nolan, imo. Nolan seemed like more of a development project, he’s pretty lucky to be up imo.

          • Also with regards to Cliche, no one has ever though of him as anything more than a 3rd/4th line center. Probably 4th. And there is no spot in the NHL that has MORE competition than the 4th line. There are only so many players skilled enough to be a top 6 guy, but there are exponentially more with the tools to be a bottom sixer. So those guys need to really stand out. Be it by fighting, being aggressive, or being a veteran whose been around the block, or a speedster or a face-off specialist, there has to be something that sets you apart. Cliche hasn’t shown that yet, though he is solid defensively, a solid leader, a decent AHL scorer. As bad as our bottom six is, Lewis and Richie have the speed game going for them, Clifford has the aggression, Westy has the size. Fraser… Well he’s the milquetoast of the bunch but he loves to fight ad has won a cup. It’s not a great group, but they have something that they do better than the average bear.

          • Who are the better candidates to call up?

            … Kozun, Vey, and Cliche would have all been better candidates to call up.

            So those guys need to really stand out. Be it by fighting, being aggressive, or being a veteran whose been around the block, or a speedster or a face-off specialist, there has to be something that sets you apart.

            … So why did they call up King? I don’t see King as aggressive at all, and without that, what does he bring to the table?

            Nolan, I can sort of understand why they did that one, and I can see potential there. I wouldn’t have called him up, personally, but OK.

            Fraser… Well he’s the milquetoast of the bunch but he loves to fight ad has won a cup.

            … Hahaha, won a Cup eh? Did he even play in the playoffs that year? Whatever. Fraser does nothing well. He’s not good defensively, he’s terrible offensively, he’s bad on the draw, he’s not versatile at all, no skill stands out, yay he fights even though he’s bad at that too, HE DOES NOTHING.

          • Kozun and Vey are not Playing so well as to definitely deserve a call up. Those are just the guys you want to get called up. Me too. But they haven’t earned it any more than Nolan or King, if anything they’ve done less to earn it.

            King brings humungasaur size and is very good along the boards.

            I said Fraser was milquetoast. I also made no substantive comment about Fraser having won a cup. Only that he has and my guess is it’s part of why he has a spot. That and he because he works hard. I agree he does nothing really well. But he is more than average at being an agitator and he isn’t BAD at anything (other than scoring). He’s here to agitate and spell the other three lines without sucking while doing so. In that he is succeeding. Do I want someone better? Damn right I do! I’m surprised he played a single game but hey, Just because I don’t like it doesn’t mean I can’t understand it.

          • As for Fraser having won a cup, DL did that in SJ as well, getting guys who had possibly seen better days, but they had a cup on their resume.

            Maybe not every team has a player or two that have won the cup, but I suppose many of them do. And while the experience is good to have someone who’s experienced that, I wonder if at times it isn’t over rated.

            The B’s had Mark Recchi last year, but other than that, I believe no one who had won it. Same w Vancouver? I think no previous cup winner.

          • JT,

            until very very recently, Vey has been about on par with the rest of the top 6 or so Manchvegas scorers. He’s on fire right now but had previously admitted he had some physical maturing to do (i.e. stop being a weak POS). Kozun had similar numbers as everyone else with a negative +/-. Cliche is another center.

  9. I am wondering if Fraser gets bumped and Loktionov returns. I’ve had “what if Penner gets hot” thoughts, too, but after a year I temper my this thought with “in a close game what would Penner bring to late 3rd period and OT besides poor conditioning?

    In some ways we are lucky Moller is overseas for we would not have had a look at Nolan.

  10. Penner’s trade value has to be on par with dogshit at this point. We are stuck with him.

    Best to hold your nose for now. He might find himself. The guy is an enigma to me. He needs to play decent if he is going to be in the NHL next year and make any money. One would think that fact alone would motivate him. He must have psychiatric issues. Who knows.

  11. Penner played his best with Kopitar, i say put Penner on Kopitars line and Brown on Richards line.
    I do think Lombardi should get some more grit for the bottom six, hopefully with some hands.

  12. Penner-Kopi-Williams
    Clifford-Richards-Carter
    Nolan-Stoll-Brown
    King-Richardson-Lewis

    That’s how you get three scoring lines. It’s also how you begin to mold Clifford into Hartnell.

    One think I did like about Murray was his philosophy about playing pairs. To me, those pairs are: Carter/Richards, Kopi/Williams and Stoll/Brown. It’s not because I don’t want Brown in the top 6. It’s because Stoll and Brown have always had chemistry together and I like the idea of having three lines that can score.

    • Clifford into Hartnell, that’s a good one.

    • It’s also how you begin to mold Clifford into Hartnell.

      … Hahahaha. C’mon son! Hartnell was a 40-point scorer at age 19, and a 20-goal man by age 21 (18 goals in 59 games). Clifford’s 21 now, and while he might score 20 in Nintendo hockey, he’s not nearly at that level right now.

      I agree more with Scribe that Clifford might become more like an Adam Graves type of player.

  13. Why not try a dominate line
    Richards kopitar carter
    Brown stoll Williams
    Penner loki Nolan
    Clifford Fraser Lewis/richarson.

    • Uh, no!
      Brown needs to be put on the 2nd line and left with Richards and Carter.
      One game does not a season make.
      Leave Clifford the fuck alone and the same for Fraser.
      It’s not Fraser’s fault that Lombardi gave Smyth away for him and salary cap room.
      He plays hard, is decent on face-offs especially for a 4th line center, hits people and stands up for his teammates always!
      Penner will play out the season and go elsewhere unless he wants to re-sign with the Kings for about $2.5 for next year.
      I don’t think Penner will re-up with us because, if he played like dogshit next year with better offensive players than he’s had alot of this year, nobody else would be willing to take a chance on him.
      I think he’s that much of a selfish prick!!!
      Loktionov can skate his ass off but, he needs to play in a different system to be effective like: Detroit, Vancouver or Pittsburgh.
      Let’s trade Lokti to the Penguins with Dustin Brown for Dupuis and Neal.

  14. Lines:
    1st-Neal/Kopitar/Nolan
    2nd-Williams/Richards/Carter
    3rd-Clifford/Stoll/Dupuis
    4th-Richardson/Fraser/King

    If Gagne Returns:
    1st-Neal/Kopitar/Dupuis
    2nd-Williams/Richards/Carter
    3rd-Gagne/Stoll/Dupuis
    4th-Clifford/Fraser/King
    Richardson-bench

  15. Sorry- Gagne Returns: 1st line: Neal/Kopitar/Nolan

  16. Here’s another trade idea:

    LA trades Brown, Penner, Bernier and Westgarth to Washington for:

    Wait for it: Semin, Vokoun and Hendricks.

    We get another 1st line sniper RW, a backup goalie signed for another year after this and an enforcer to stir up the room some more.

    Can you imagine:
    1st line:
    Williams/Kopitar/Semin
    2nd line:
    Nolan(Gagne)/Richards/Carter
    3rd line:
    Clifford/Stoll/Lewis
    4th line:
    Richardson/Fraser/King
    Bench:Hendricks

    Goalie:
    Quick
    Vokoun

  17. Hendricks: has 48 career points in 195 games, 6′ 208lbs, 30 years old
    Westgarth: no so much! 6’4″ 230lbs, 28 years old

  18. Interesting. I would go with brown- kopi- williams
    penner-richards- carter ( how nice is that to pencil in)? Richardson- Stoll- Lewis ( stopper line) and then keep your fourth line intact. I would love to get rid of stoll for some wingers. Then we can have three centers, Kopi, Carter, Richards. All we need are wingers. Basically only the penguins can match up with that if Crosby is healthy. Then again it’s early and my brain isn’t functioning properly. Let me know what you think.

  19. General question for anyone: when you want to copy and paste s.o. else’s comments and have it be in italics, how exactly do you do that please?

    • You do an open

      Same thing for after the quoted text but with a / before the i or em. Make sense? I can’t really show you because it thinks I’m doing it myself and doesn’t show up.

      i and /i

      or

      em and /em

      Wrapping in

      • Sorry Surls….. an open? I’m on a Mac if that helps. But it’s obviously something I do on my keyboard, not on the site.

        Can you have one more go at it?

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